Coop Posted August 1, 2020 Author Share Posted August 1, 2020 Interior door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 I would probably take it down some then sticker again for four or five days. Then do your final thickness and start construction. Once you are down to final thickness if the parts are going to set for a day or so with out being assembled just stack then or lay them flat, don't sticker them and don't leave them on any cast iron surfaces. Cast iron can be like a sponge and suck moisture out which may cause the wood to still move some AND rust the cast iron... Go ahead, ask me how I know this.? 3 Quote "Do not spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; remember that what you now have was once among the things you only hoped for." - Epicurus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richarda Posted August 2, 2020 Share Posted August 2, 2020 On 7/31/2020 at 10:27 PM, Coop said: It will be approx 6-8 weeks before the contractor will need the door. Right now, the boards are in the shop/garage, stickered and are about 3/8” shy of the desired 1 1/2” thickness. Would it be better to: 1. Joint and plane them down to the 1 1/2” and build the door now and move it inside? 2. Move the boards inside and build the door closer to desired time? 3. Hell, there are so many options, I’m open to suggestions. Thanks Again, this will be an interior dood. Ken, I think you've gone as far as you can until you have the exact door opening Option #2 is in my opinion is the way to go. You still have plenty of time. Don't do any profiles or anything else until you know exactly what you are going to build. Right now it's really guesswork. Don't guess, get it right the first time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 2, 2020 Author Share Posted August 2, 2020 Yeah, that’s the way I’m leaning. I’ll just practice on cutting mortises right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 I’m still taking notes. The bottom rail will be 8”, the top 5” and the center rails will be 3”. Is there and advantage to using double mortise and tenons on the top and bottom rails? As a refresher, the stiles will be 5” wide. And from the looks of practice cuts, I can get a good solid 1 1/2” deep mortise from my new 1/2” bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenskye (Bryan) Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 I don't now if it will give major advantages, but I would probably do where you can. Have you asked the boss about a single large pane of glass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 7, 2020 Author Share Posted August 7, 2020 I can see where two tenons side by side would give more glue area but I don’t know if two, end to end would have an advantage. I think I will just go with one large one. Bryan, I kind of decided against just one large panel as I think that the center rails will give me a better chance of the door not twisting or racking. Not really sure that is accurate as I don’t find any evidence to substantiate it. In fact, the more mortises and tenons I add, probably increases the chance that I will cut a mortise not square which will increase my chance of twisting it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 24, 2020 Author Share Posted August 24, 2020 I thought I could copy and paste but not the case. Kev’s latest concerning floating tenons was to to make a jig, for repetitive mortises. I will be making 12 of these, mortises for floating tenons. Again, this will be for an interior door, 36” wide. My main concern is for the mortises to be completely parallel to the reference side. The upper left corner must be on the exact same plane as the lower right corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Coop said: I thought I could copy and paste but not the case. Kev’s latest concerning floating tenons was to to make a jig, for repetitive mortises. I will be making 12 of these, mortises for floating tenons. Again, this will be for an interior door, 36” wide. My main concern is for the mortises to be completely parallel to the reference side. The upper left corner must be on the exact same plane as the lower right corner. For your interior door, I don't think you really need a double mortise and tenon. Assuming you're probably less than 8/4 total thickness, a single M&T should be sufficient. If you're on the thicker side, just step up to a 1/2" M&T. So, you'll have 8 mortises and 4 tenons. I'm not sure I'd create the jig for the guide bushing for this but, if an extra video from me would help, give a shout and I'll do it. Proper layout is the key to pulling this off. Get a few squares, set them to your needed measurements, make sure your make your marks from the same reference surface, and you should be fine. Or, bring your door Northwest and we'll build it in my shop ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 13 hours ago, Kev said: For your interior door, I don't think you really need a double mortise and tenon. The fact the the door is going to have glass in it, I think I would still go with a double mortise and tenon just for some piece of mind. I don't know how much heavier glass is then wood panels but I do think it would be heavier. So I think the double mortise would give you more strength and help with any possible racking. Quote "Do not spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; remember that what you now have was once among the things you only hoped for." - Epicurus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Chet said: The fact the the door is going to have glass in it, I think I would still go with a double mortise and tenon just for some piece of mind. I don't know how much heavier glass is then wood panels but I do think it would be heavier. So I think the double mortise would give you more strength and help with any possible racking. And that's the cool part.. Neither answer is wrong, just a difference of opinion. You do get more glue surface with double M&T but, smaller M&Ts.. With a single, you can have a beefier M&T. Is one better than the other? I don't honestly know. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 I think one beefier tenon would cause less room to make a mistake. Doing two smaller ones doubles your chance of a small error taking place. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 25, 2020 Author Share Posted August 25, 2020 Jamie, I agree and less chance of screw up is on my side. The tenon will be 1/2” thick with the rails and stiles being 1 1/2” thick. I just need to make sure my plunges are completely parallel to the outsides of the boards to keep from skewing the whole lot. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 25, 2020 Author Share Posted August 25, 2020 I did final thickness today and took them back inside. After Laura decides what she wants to do with the Gulf coast, I will get back at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 16 minutes ago, Coop said: Jamie, I agree and less chance of screw up is on my side. The tenon will be 1/2” thick with the rails and stiles being 1 1/2” thick. I just need to make sure my plunges are completely parallel to the outsides of the boards to keep from skewing the whole lot. If memory serves me correctly, you recently invested in the second edge guide didn't you? If so, this really helps keep things stable so, tipping the router isn't as easy to do.. For the record, the material in the M&T video was a about 1 3/4" thick so, not too different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted August 25, 2020 Author Share Posted August 25, 2020 Memory is correct. And I’ve made a jig to give me more surface area for the mortises on the ends of the rails. I’ll just take it slow and easy and make sure I reference all cuts from the same sides. Hell, I have to build the door jamb too. If there is a catty whompas in the door, I’ll adjust for it in the the frame! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted September 3, 2020 Author Share Posted September 3, 2020 I just today got a little project out of my shop and am itching to start on the door. Even though there will only be 8 total pieces involved, the jointery will be critical, IMO. The rails being completely square cut and the mortises being square and plumb. I love my ROS but hopefully it won’t be equipped with anything lower than 220! I think also that I will build the jamb/frame from walnut. My research shows pros and I don’t knows about the grooves on the backside of the frame boards. Anyone have an opinion? I definitely would like to have a good set (3) of hinges. I’m open for opinions here as well. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 17 minutes ago, Coop said: I just today got a little project out of my shop and am itching to start on the door. Even though there will only be 8 total pieces involved, the jointery will be critical, IMO. The rails being completely square cut and the mortises being square and plumb. I love my ROS but hopefully it won’t be equipped with anything lower than 220! I think also that I will build the jamb/frame from walnut. My research shows pros and I don’t knows about the grooves on the backside of the frame boards. Anyone have an opinion? I definitely would like to have a good set (3) of hinges. I’m open for opinions here as well. Thanks I assume you're referring to the grooves that come on the manufactured jams? If so, don't worry about them. You should have plenty of room for 3 hinges! Don't overthink the jam as it only has 3 sides and is screwed level and plumb for the door. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 The groove on the back of jams had something to do with door jams and plaster and lathe wall construction but most things are sheet rock these days. 1 Quote "Do not spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; remember that what you now have was once among the things you only hoped for." - Epicurus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 I was doing a little research on those grooves and the consensus that I found was that manufacturers were doing it to help prevent cupping. Most likely due to the fact that their lumber probably doesn't get a full drying before being put into use. If that's correct, it's certainly a technique that I wouldn't have thought of to prevent cupping. In your case, you're using dried lumber so, I don't see that being an issue for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 Yea the thing I mentioned above was something I heard on this old house many years back and they were talking about fitting door jams in homes with lathe walls was a little different then with sheet rock. After I posted I started to think that I may have missed what they were talking about, and it was a long time back so forget what I said. ? 1 Quote "Do not spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; remember that what you now have was once among the things you only hoped for." - Epicurus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 47 minutes ago, Chet said: Yea the thing I mentioned above was something I heard on this old house many years back and they were talking about fitting door jams in homes with lathe walls was a little different then with sheet rock. After I posted I started to think that I may have missed what they were talking about, and it was a long time back so forget what I said. ? For all I really know, you could be 100% right.. That's just what I found in about 10 minutes of looking on the net.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted September 4, 2020 Author Share Posted September 4, 2020 I saw a video a while back and thought I book marked it but can’t find it now. Showed an old timer installing the frame/jamb in the opening and he had a very good method. The one thing that impressed me was that he said to never screw thru your shims as they were there to adjust the gap thru the final process and screwing thru them negated their purpose. Makes sense. If and I probably will, make the frame from walnut, it will have to come from a supplier as all I have left are 9/4 slabs. I’m still out of likes (guess it’s for a 24 hr period) so thanks to all for your comments and help. K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, Kev said: I was doing a little research on those grooves and the consensus that I found was that manufacturers were doing it to help prevent cupping. Most likely due to the fact that their lumber probably doesn't get a full drying before being put into use. If that's correct, it's certainly a technique that I wouldn't have thought of to prevent cupping. In your case, you're using dried lumber so, I don't see that being an issue for you. The groves are to allow air flow to prevent the show side from drying more than the back is what I’ve been told. If the jamb is nailed tight no air would get to the back side. Not that much air is probably moving behind the jamb. A lot of hardwoods floors come the same way. Edited September 4, 2020 by Jamie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted September 4, 2020 Author Share Posted September 4, 2020 I have a sneaking suspicion that my framer will be my trim guy and my concrete and roofing and Sheetrock guy so a few little grooves probably won’t make much difference! ? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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